Welcome, Guest.
It's May 23, 2017, 4:47pm.
Please login or register.
Home Page Soft targets and bias
SeSco    Secret Scotland    Around the country  ›  Soft targets and bias Moderators: Admin
Users Browsing Forum
Baidu Spider and 14 Guests

Soft targets and bias  This thread currently has 814 views. Print Print Thread
2 Pages 1 2 » All Recommend Thread
Apollo
June 17, 2010, 12:01pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
It's not often I'm lost for words, but two stories that popped up on my desktop had me in that state, or possibly more accurately, gagged because what I'd like to say would be classed as racist, or not 'politically correct'.

The first related to the mandatory five-year prison sentence handed down to a 53-year old woman found in possession of a wartime handgun.

BBC News - Grandmother jailed over WWII 'family heirloom' pistol

Would the same sentence have been handed down so readily had the subject not been such a soft-target? Would an ethnic teen from Birmingham with a string of offences and social workers reporting on his deprived, stigmatised, and racially challenged life been given the same, or let off because it wasn't really his fault.

Where is the benefit in incarcerating this woman for five years?

I'm wondering how long I might get for having accumulated a couple of dozen hammers over the years BBC News - Man killed his wife with hammer

Then there's the other gem, of CCTV cameras being covered up in Birmingham because they are areas with Muslin populations.

BBC News - Plastic bags to be put over Birmingham 'terror cameras'

Excuse me, but I thought we all British on this island, and supposed to be treated equally - isn't that the call we hear from certain areas?

I can think of a few Scots who will want to know why they are being subject to lots of CCTV, and why there are no black plastic bags allowed over those cameras.

One rule for...
Logged
E-mail E-mail
jmb
June 17, 2010, 1:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Secret
Posts: 2803
Location: Fort William
I get the feeling there is more to the case

Quoted Text
Cochrane - who has a previous conviction for serious assault - earlier admitted illegal possession of the gun at her Dundee home last June.

Read more: http://www.thescottishsun.co.u.....s.html#ixzz0r7EJPCzF


Quoted Text
The gun was found after police arrived at Cochrane's home with an arrest warrant for her son


Quoted Text
The judge added that others could have had access to the weapon, including John Cochrane, who has previous convictions for assault and possession of a knife.
Logged Offline
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 1 - 59
Apollo
June 17, 2010, 1:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Apologies - I had intended to add a similar comment. Thanks.
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 2 - 59
jmb
June 17, 2010, 6:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Secret
Posts: 2803
Location: Fort William
It does seem likely that the paper has mixed up her son's conviction and said she had a previous conviction.

I still think there is more to the case that comes over in the report.

But you have to be pretty stupid to keep a gun, even if I had one with a spike rammed in the barrel to make it unusable I would want confirmation that it was not illegal.  There are regular amnesties and I think they do not charge someone who contacts to say they have found a gun in the effects of someone who has died.

A friend had a WWI Vickers heavy machine gun on tripod handed in to his station during one amnesty :=)

MB
Logged Offline
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 3 - 59
Dugald
June 17, 2010, 9:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Secret
Posts: 1212
The "Sun" says:

"She said there was "no reasonable explanation for not handing in the gun" after 29 years. The sentence was met with outrage by her son John as he stormed from the court. He shouted: "You're having a f***ing laugh."

Cochrane - who has a previous conviction for serious assault - earlier admitted illegal possession of the gun at her Dundee home last June.".


From these two paragraphs: the subject in the concluding sentence of the first paragraph is the son, not the woman. In the second paragraph the subject is still the son, not the woman. although the her bit shoots that down. Conclusion? The son is the person who has a previous conviction for serious assault. Hmmmm, well it's bloody ambiguous anyway!

Either way, i was happier before i read the article!
Logged Offline
E-mail E-mail Reply: 4 - 59
BenCooper
June 17, 2010, 9:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Enigma
Posts: 587
The last page of the Courier article says:

Quoted Text
She told Cochrane that it was an aggravating factor that her son had prior convictions for assault and carrying a knife and that she had a previous conviction, from 2001, for assault to severe injury.


http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2010/06/17/newsstory15234208t0.asp

She also had it under her mattress. It does sound like there's a bit more to this than a sweet granny innocently holding onto a heirloom.

With regards to the CCTV cameras, the important point is that these were cameras set up specifically to monitor and record the movements of muslims. They were not general crime-fighting* cameras as all the other cameras we see about are, they were targetted at a specific group, which is pretty dodgy both legally and morally.

*Not that cameras ever actually fight crime.
Logged Offline
E-mail E-mail Reply: 5 - 59
WM
June 28, 2010, 10:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Enigma
Posts: 929
Quoted Text
Police, looking for her son with a warrant for his arrest, found it under the mattress in her bedroom when she allowed them to search her home.


Were they looking for him under the mattress? Did they have the right to do a general search when the warrant was for the arrest of the son, not for a search of the property?
An arrest and a search warrant are two different things.
Logged Offline
E-mail E-mail Reply: 6 - 59
Apollo
November 24, 2010, 2:28am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Nice to see some sense can eventually prevail:

BBC News - Grandmother's WWII gun prison sentence quashed

There was not even any ammunition involved, and the media seems to have forgotten about all the 'fluff' it added to the earlier accounts. And the judges probably had to spend more time debating on making one of their own look a bit silly, and leaving the woman in jail to avoid that ...

Following the ruling, Cochrane said she was relieved the case was over and added: "It has been a nightmare."

The grandmother-of-six, who spent six weeks in prison before being freed pending her appeal, said: "It was just devastating. I will never, ever do anything like that again. It has actually ruined my life."

She added: "When I got five years I was just like - five years - I haven't done anything wrong. It was a war trophy. I didn't have bullets or anything."

Cochrane was originally jailed for the minimum term for illegal possession of a firearm after police found the unlicensed military pistol during a search at her home in Dundee.

The judge, Lady Smith, said she was not satisfied that it was one of the rare cases where it could be shown that exceptional circumstances existed.

When these circumstances exist, the minimum jail term does not have to be imposed.

But defence lawyers challenged the decision, arguing that the sentencing judge had erred in ruling that exceptional circumstances did not exist.

Her case initially divided the two appeal judges who heard it, Lord Clarke and Lord Hardie, and it was referred to a bench of three judges.
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 7 - 59
WM
November 24, 2010, 8:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Enigma
Posts: 929
At last common sense has prevailed. This was not a criminal keeping a gun to be used in pursuit of crime. She did not have ammunition for it, and i wonder if ammunition is still actually available for a gun of that age, so she could not have injured anyone with it, so it would not have been any more dangerous or threatening than any of the realistic replicas freely available.
Logged Offline
E-mail E-mail Reply: 8 - 59
Apollo
November 24, 2010, 11:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Of course you can own a replica.

You cannot take it out in public, and will be treated in the same way as if you were out with a loaded, active firearm.

The Act was amended a few years ago, and the ASBO rules also do not allow firearms (and this includes replicas and air weapons) to be carried or shown in public without reason, or under defined conditions.
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 9 - 59
Apollo
April 27, 2011, 12:50am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Thinking back to the case of the grandmother jailed - and later released - after spending six weeks of a five year sentence imposed for possessing a firearm.

It looks as if possession does not have the same impact now:
Quoted Text
A man who hid a double-barrel shotgun under his grandmother's garden shed is behind bars.

Martin O'Reilly was arrested after police raided the property in Cleeves Road, Nitshill, Glasgow, in April last year.

Officers swooped after receiving a tip-off that O'Reilly had stored the weapon there.

The Russian made gun - which was in working order - was discovered wrapped in plastic bags.

...

Aw c'mon system... this grandmother was clearly 'in possession' - ignorance is no excuse in the law - why wasn't she carted off?

If she denied it, couldn't she have been lying, and keeping it for him?

Man hid shotgun under his grandmother's garden shed | Glasgow and West | STV News

Tut tut tut
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 10 - 59
Apollo
July 16, 2011, 2:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Warrant issued for gran who had jail term quashed for keeping father's 'war trophy' gun.
Quoted Text
A grandmother who had a five-year jail term quashed for keeping a Second World War heirloom gun has had a warrant issued for her arrest.

Gail Cochrane had previously been spared the prison sentence after having her case heard at the Court of Criminal Appeal.

The 54-year-old from Dundee was sentenced after admitting keeping hold of her Royal Navy veteran father’s pistol for 29 years.

She had the jail term replaced with an order to carry out 240 hours community service in November last year after her case split appeal judges.

Since then, Cochrane has experienced health problems that have been blamed as a reason for her not completing her order.

On Thursday, judges were to review her progress with the unpaid work order at the Court of Criminal Appeal in Edinburgh.

However, Cochrane did not show and a warrant for her arrest was issued for her arrest by the court.

...

Warrant issued for gran who had jail term quashed for keeping father's 'war trophy' gun | Dundee and Tayside | STV News
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 11 - 59
Apollo
July 16, 2011, 2:25pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
See also:

Wedding gift of Russian rifle could lead to jail term for husband:
Quoted Text
High Court: Heard Wallace planned to turn the gun into ornament. Pic: © STV

A woman's wedding gift of a deactivated Kalashnikov rifle to her husband could lead to him being jailed for at least five years.

John Wallace was given the present by spouse Angie after it was purchased on the internet.

Wallace then planned to turn the weapon - which was legal to own - into an "ornamental feature" at their home in Ayr.

A number of parts - including a barrel and piston carrier - were later also sourced on the web. But the 47-year-old van driver did not have permission to own these components.

Police later discovered the items at the couple's house after being called for an unrelated matter.

Wallace has now appeared at the High Court in Glasgow after admitting to possessing the components without the authority of the Secretary of State. A judge will decide in August whether there are "exceptional circumstances" which will allow Wallace to avoid the minimum five year jail-term for such offences.

Wallace's lawyer had earlier told the court of the "very strange background" of how he first came into contact with the deactivated Russian-designed rifle.

Mark Moir, defending, said it had been a wedding gift from his wife.

Mr Moir added: "He wanted to create an ornamental feature using the Kalashnikov and its parts.

"This is something maybe not considered appropriate by everyone."

The court heard the rifle and the components were found under a bed at the couple's home in Stobhill Crescent, Ayr, on August 10, 2010.

Lord Turnbull told the court: "I think that there is room to consider whether exceptional circumstances do exist in this case."

The judge adjourned the hearing for a proof in mitigation - where further evidence is likely to be heard - at the High Court in Edinburgh on August 22.

Wedding gift of Russian rifle could lead to jail term for husband | Glasgow and West | STV News
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 12 - 59
Apollo
July 22, 2011, 2:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
I wonder how many cases such as these - if we refer to them as "unwitting" gun crimes committed by people who are unaware of the law - are unreported?

I also wonder if, rather than pouncing on an easy conviction - the sentence is mandatory in these cases - it would not be more productive to have more 'carrot' than 'stick' and have some sort of perpetual amnesty for cases where the person can be reasonably easily shown to have a non-criminal intent with regard to the possession or discovery of the weapon, and is more ignorant than they are criminal.

I've given the full text below, as it's clear this current system is deeply flawed, and this case really is an abuse of the system, as it has been used to impose a 5-year+ sentence on a criminal who committed a 4-month crime.

And while I do not suggest the 63-year old victim of the theft should go to prison for five years either, in light of the evidence, she was possession of the viable firearm and ammunition for a lot longer than the thief, yet appears to have escaped any sort of prosecution despite having broken the law for may years.
Quoted Text
A thief from Moray who "unwittingly" stole a gun from the house of a widow has been jailed for five years.

Guy Whitelaw, 28, from Forres, told police he discovered the handgun in a cash box he took from the house.

Whitelaw admitted having the gun and was given minimum jail term for illegal possession of a firearm.

He told the court the victim, a 63-year-old woman who said the gun had belonged to her late husband, should be prosecuted for not having a permit.

The High Court in Edinburgh heard Whitelaw broke into the house in March and took jewellery, money and the cash box containing the handgun.

The court heard Whitelaw considered handing the weapon in to police, but panicked and instead hid it in his garden at Anderson Crescent in Forres.

When officers investigating the break-in tracked him down he led them to the gun, which was in poor condition but capable of firing.

The court heard the gun had belonged to the victim's late husband but she had "effectively forgotten" about it.

Whitelaw's solicitor advocate Ian Cruickshank argued that exceptional circumstances did exist in the case that could allow the judge not to impose the minimum five years imprisonment.

He said the Crown had conceded that Whitelaw would not have known the gun was in the house and that he had no knowledge of the presence of the weapon.
'Pay the consequences'

Mr Cruickshank said Whitelaw was "horrified" when he discovered the gun and as an "interim measure" buried the gun in the garden.

The defence lawyer said Whitelaw had perhaps "unwittingly" committed the second crime of possessing the gun after the break-in.

Judge Lord Woolman told him there were no exceptional circumstances to allow him to escape the minimum jail term of five years for illegal possession of a firearm.

He said: "You knew what you were doing was wrong and you must pay the consequences.

"The unlawful possession and use of firearms is a grave source of danger to society."

Lord Woolman also imposed a four-month sentence for the break-in, to run concurrently.

BBC News - Man who 'unwittingly' stole gun jailed for five years

I don't usually criticise the courts (except in the case of the vile 'Not Proven' verdict we still have the power to inflict on victims), but there seems to be something wrong with this mandatory stuff, which seems to be applicable only when it suits the court, and not at other time, or for people who have committed the offence, but the courts hare happy to ignore, or turn a blind eye to.

Inconsistent legislation is probably worse than no legislation - especially for those it touches - as they have no idea what the outcome may be.
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 13 - 59
Apollo
November 17, 2011, 10:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
Looks as if there is some sense being applied to this mandatory business - although there still seems to be no mention of the person who originally had the gun in question going to jail for having the undeclared weapon and ammunition in her possession for years.

Seems there's one mandatory for some, and another mandatory for others... unless you're a granny, as the two cases above show.

Even though she acknowledged ro police that the items were in her possession, and admitted she had 'Forgotten they were there', there's still no mention of her mandatory sentence and appeal.
Quoted Text
A thief who unintentionally stole a gun from a widow's home has been freed by appeal judges.

Guy Whitelaw claimed he did not mean to steal the revolver when he broke into a 63-year-old woman's house in March.

The 29-year-old was jailed for the minimum five years for illegal possession of a firearm at the High Court in Edinburgh in July.

Appeal judges threw out the "abritray and disproportionate" sentence and gave Whitelaw, also known as McCall, six months in jail on Thursday.

The robber, from Forres in Moray, admitted breaking into the retired woman's home and stealing jewellery, coins, money, a TV remote control and the handgun, which was stashed in a cash box in a safe.

At first he denied the housebreaking, but revealed information about a gun. He later told officers he had discovered the stolen gun but buried it "because I can get five years straight away for it".

The revolver had belonged to the woman's late husband and she told police she had "effectively forgotten it was there".

Illegal possession of a gun carries a minimum sentence of five years in prison unless exceptional circumstances can be shown.

The trial judge ruled there were no exceptional circumstances and said the possession of a firearm was "a grave source of danger to society".

Defence counsel Claire Mitchell told the appeal court that her client did not set out to have the gun.

She said: "He effectively dug a hole in the ground and put it into that hole and covered it up."

The judge, Lord Clarke, said: "The Crown accepted that he did not know about the presence of the gun in the house in question and did not discover it until he opened a cash box a short time after leaving the house."

'Unintentional' gun thief wins appeal against five-year jail term | Aberdeen and North | STV News
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 14 - 59
Apollo
March 24, 2012, 2:14pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Forewarned is Forearmed
Secret
Posts: 14088
While I understand the thinking in the slightly defective minds of those who advocate the concept of 'mandatory' jail sentences, like the crazy idea that minimum pricing of alcohol will make any difference in that area, the concept should be one that, if not forgotten and relegated to history, should surely be tempered with some sort of qualification regarding aspects such a s 'who' and 'when' it is deemed to be something that is applicable.

While it's usually fair to say that 'Ignorance of the law' is no excuse, this is fundamentally different from having no knowledge of something that might result in a law being broken.

A more sensible and balanced consideration of such things would (or perhaps could) have avoided the scenario of people (who handily happened to be grannies, just to keep the media happy) being given automatic 5-year jail sentences that later had to waste yet more court time (and we are told courts are overloaded) as they are reconsidered, and effectively quashed.

The matter is still dragging on months later - yet if there had been a more sensible approach levelled by the authorities - in the absence of a 'no discussion' mandatory jail term being applied - then a lot of time (and I suspect lawyers/solicitors/costs) could have been avoided.

(See how quick the case against the thief who stole the gun from her house was dealt with - it's the previous post above.)

And looking at this specific case - can we take that the 64-year old granny would now be looking forward to B&B at out expense for the next five years if had not conveniently turned out that she had been so keen to work in her community.
Quoted Text
A grandmother who faced a five-year jail sentence for illegally possessing a revolver has been shown mercy by a High Court judge

Widow Kathleen Woodward was arrested after admitting to police she kept a Harrington and Richardson seven-shot pistol in her Moray home, along with ammunition.

The firearm belonged to her late husband who had died in the 1990s.

The offence came to light when the gun was stolen by thief Guy Whitelaw as he ransacked her house in March last year.

Detectives were forced to arrest the 64-year-old homeowner after she admitted she was breaking the law by storing the weapon without a licence.

Strict gun laws dictate that people caught with illegal firearms will automatically receive a minimum five-year jail sentence.

At the High Court in Edinburgh on Friday, Lady Stacey ruled that there were enough unusual circumstances in the case to allow her to admonish Mrs Woodward, who wept as she heard the judge's decision.

Lady Stacey came to her decision after hearing of the work Mrs Woodward does in the community.

Grandmother avoids jail over late husband's illegal firearm | Aberdeen and North | STV News

BBC News - Moray widow Kathleen Woodward spared jail over illegal pistol
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 15 - 59
Admin
March 17, 2014, 3:33am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
The silly five-year mandatory jail sentence has been in the news again, and again because it has been waived.

While the idea makes sense to some, the time wasted in bringing cases that are ultimately thrown out should be sending a signal that it doesn't work, or at least doesn't work as intended.

In this case, there seems to be an additional level of madness in the case of another 'soft target' being penalised and punished where there is clearly no point.

Reading various accounts of this case, a man who kept a sawn-off shotgun in his loft for 20 years is said to have "escaped a jail sentence" thanks to the age of a Swedish plastic bag, when the High Court in Glasgow heard that he told police he was given the shotgun when he was just 14 after being asked to keep it by a group of "older boys" he was hanging about with at the time.

The non-functioning shotgun lay wrapped in the bag, untouched and ultimately forgotten in the loft for 20 years.

Yet the court still ordered him to carry out 200 hours of unpaid work.

Why? Deterrent? Compensation to a terrorised community?

What appears to be missing from all the accounts is a reason being given for WHY the police were searching his loft when they came across this forgotten piece of scrap metal. And the loft was not even easily accessible, as it had no ladder.

"The court heard that Blair was arrested in May last year after police discovered the weapon hidden in a loft at the home he shared with his mother."

That would have been nice to know, and might explain the sentence.

Plastic bag saves Jamie Blair from gun find jail term

Man escapes jail for shotgun charge thanks to Swedish plastic bag | Glasgow & West | News | STV

Plastic bag saves Helensburgh man who stashed shotgun in mum's loft from jail | News | Helensburgh Advertiser

There's another anomaly of sorts.... if the house was his mother's, why was she not in court as well?

It's her house, so what's in it is her responsibility.

Look at the earlier cases given above, and the little old ladies in court thanks to old war souvenirs.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 16 - 59
Admin
August 23, 2014, 2:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
It's good to know the police are catching these dangerous armed pensioners and grannies, and that the courts are vigorously enforcing the mandatory 5-year sentence which must be applied without question when someone possesses an illegal firearm
Quoted Text
A 76-year-old Aberdeen first offender who left unwanted guns "gathering dust" in his basement has been warned he could face a five-year jail sentence.

Police found a corroded sawn-off shotgun, another shotgun in poor condition and an antique pistol at Richard Watt's home.

Pensioner who had guns 'gathering dust' in basement warned about jail

It must make it so much easier for armed criminals with guns that no-one knows about, or have been stolen or smuggled into the country, to sleep easy at night, knowing that no-one is likely to bother them or throw them in jail.



Another one to keep an eye out for - and see if the sentence is waived... yet again.

Maybe someone will twig to the possibility that there is maybe something wrong with a law which has to be waived almost every time it is mentioned.

Lord knows what will happen if the Scottish Government imposes its promised tougher regime of firearm legislation and licensing conditions, and scoops up a whole new group of people who have previously not fallen under these rules before - and which will obviously not apply south of the border, to most of this island, in England and Wales which has the bulk of the population.

It's slightly worrying that the some claim the police in Scotland are to be "routinely armed" through changes that have not been subject to review or approval outside the organisation, yet the people are to be further restricted on their possession of firearms - under a system which is already extreme and allows few people to own guns legally, and handguns are now almost unobtainable.

Witness the near hysteria of the media recently, when a SINGLE shotgun shell was dropped in an athletes' bus after a Commonwealth Games practice session at the Barry Buddon ranges - you'd think they left a small armoury there rather than a singe cartridge:

Ammunition found on National Express bus taken from Barry Buddon | Dundee & Tayside | News
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 17 - 59
Admin
August 30, 2014, 9:57am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Worthy of mention because it's NOT a soft target or bias.

And be interesting to see the outcome of sentencing if the media should follow-up to the conclusion.

Police called after Shawn Doherty took replica pistol to school | Highlands & Islands | News

It's almost funny, seeing how a 16-year old boy might still have a sufficiently not yet 'fully cooked' brain, and think that anybody (court in particular) would believe he picked up the 'wrong' bag and ended up taking a gas-powered hand-gun to school.

The mere fact that he did not keep it out of sight and make sure no-one was aware of it until he could get back home without it being discovered is proof of his deception.

He further betrays his unsuitability to even posses the item, as it turn out it was loaded, so falls foul of the law (and rules) regarding it having it loaded in a public place - never mind the school, as he carried thought the streets to get there. And his response  ‘Yes, but the safety is on’  just confirms he doesn't have a clue. It takes a split second to flip the safety off, and a gas gun is ready to fire - no need to cock. We don't know the exact model, but many gas-powered models are repeaters too, and can be manually loaded from an in-built magazine.

And then we have the possibility that he has dyslexia and has to work "twice as hard" as others. That's tough for the lad - but not really anything to do with taking the gun to school to show it off - which is really what he did, and got caught.

Bull has a strong smell, and it smells strongly from his claims of innocence.

People like this are why the rest of us can't have nice things.

5-years mandatory (if he had been a pensioner)

Let's see where this one goes.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 18 - 59
Admin
August 31, 2014, 9:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
The media likes to play games, and I've noticed a few stories in recent times that take advantage of air-rifles falling under firearms legislation, meaning that the media will happily use that as licence to refer to such items as firearms.

When I spotted the following story, and thought that the mandatory 5-year sentence for possession of an actual firearm had not been applied because it was not a little old pensioner that had been caught, I had a closer look.

Linlithgow man fined for having a gun - Linlithgow Journal and Gazette

As can be seen from the text of the article, the writer has happily referred to the air-rifle as a firearm during the early part of the story - thereby making it more dramatic by referring to the rifle as such, and indicating it was loaded with ammunition. All just about technically correct, but also unnecessarily alarmist.

Only toward the latter part of the article do we learn this was an air-rifle - and peanut power compared to a real firearm, or a item that will land the carrier with a 5-year mandatory sentence - even if they're a pensioner.

We have enough problems without manufacturing them in the form of media click-bait.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 19 - 59
Admin
September 2, 2014, 9:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Deception...

Level: Expert

If you're going to wander around with a weapon - hide it properly!

Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 20 - 59
Admin
September 4, 2014, 7:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Oh dear...

Somebody didn't have much of a leg to stand on and try to get out of the 5-year mandatory holiday in this case:
Quoted Text
A former army sniper who was caught with a cache of firearms and ammunition at his home in South Lanarkshire has been jailed for five years.

Hugh Hunter, 58, admitted 10 firearms charges after the haul was found at his house in Libberton on 8 August 2013.

The High Court in Glasgow heard the cache included a British Forces pistol, a World War II rifle and 3,500 bullets.

Hunter was caught after two men reported that he may have been carrying a weapon while walking his dog.

The 58-year-old told police he was not planning anything illegal and had only bought the arsenal to keep it away from gangsters.

Hugh Hunter jailed over huge weapons cache in Lanarkshire

Although it makes no difference - the 5-year sentence is mandatory - I can't help but think he'd have been better to shut up, or just say he was interested in the firearms, rather than come up with the claim of keeping them away from gansters... unless that was advised by his lawyer, who perhaps thought it was a 'good idea' for some reason.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 21 - 59
Admin
September 6, 2014, 2:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Yet another pensioner escapes the 5-year mandatory sentence for having 20-year old rusty gun lying forgotten in his cellar.

It's good to know all these dangerous armed criminals are being tracked down, found, and dealt with.

We're all much safer

140 hours of unpaid community service will make this hardened and dangerous convicted criminal think twice about... forgetting anything.
Quoted Text
Sentencing Watt to a community payback order of 140 hours of unpaid work on Friday, Lord Burns said: “Parliament has specifically provided that unless exceptional circumstances exist, I should impose a custodial sentence.

"That is because it was thought necessary to send out a deterrent message in all such cases. As is obvious, the mere possession of such a weapon can create real risk to the public if such a weapon were to be stolen.

I'm wondering who the judge might think would have been likely to steal the relics in this case, after they had lain rusting for 20 years.

HMA v RICHARD WATT - Judgments & Sentences - Judiciary of Scotland

Aberdeen pensioner Richard Watt avoids jail over guns

Police found shotguns in basement at Aberdeen home of Richard Watt | Aberdeen & North | News

Still can't help having the slightest tiny niggle of doubt about this law, since it generally seems to need to be overturned when it's applied, as the folk it would jail are potentially likely to die in jail before they do their time.

Scotland has proposals to widen the catchment of this Act, potentially adding more unsuspecting people into the net for this sentence.

Perhaps they'd be better ditching the mandatory aspect (instead of having to disregard it so often) and increase the potential sentence that those it really applies to can be given, and keep them locked up and out of harm's way for longer.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 22 - 59
Admin
October 1, 2014, 9:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
It's reassuring to know that the authorities are on the ball, and keeping us safe from all these pensioners with rusty old guns, and making sure that even if they're in their eighties, that the mandatory 5-year prison sentence is applied:

OAP facing jail over illegal target pistol - Edinburgh Evening News

I for one sleep more soundly in my bed knowing they are secure, and the authorities are paying attention to these dangerous individuals, leaving others free to get on with their work:

Four men raid home and steal cash and jewellery Crewe Road South | Edinburgh & East | News
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 23 - 59
Admin
November 3, 2014, 10:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Looks like the 5 year mandatory sentence for having guns lying around is not all bad, and sometimes get applied to the right people.

What else can you do but applaud when an Elvis impersonator get locked up and taken out of circulation to protect the population
Quoted Text
The lead singer of Elvis Presley tribute band DW and The Road Rockets, admitted 11 firearms offences and was jailed for five years.

It says 'firearms offences' but we know the real reason
He even wore sunglasses in the dock!
Quoted Text
“A Webley and Scott .38 revolver was found in a bag of paperwork in a dressing room by the main bedroom which Mr Weaver shared with his partner,” he told the court.

“A Hammer shotgun which had been shortened was found in a drawer of a cabinet also in the dressing room. Neither was loaded.

“Unlicensed firearms were found in a storage cupboard in the eaves of the roof off from a bedroom. Ammunition was found upstairs in an Elvis shrine.

“The defendant is an Elvis fan and spends a lot of his time as an Elvis impersonator.”

Elvis impersonator jailed over illegal gun stash - The Scotsman
Consider we were lucky... If he hadn't been found for another few years, he might have been able to claim he was just a little old harmless innocent pensioner, and asked for a few hours community service instead'
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 24 - 59
Admin
December 6, 2014, 11:18am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Intriguing find in the US, I believe is almost 2 year old story.

Despite what some think as having liberal views on gun ownership, not that it matters in the UK and matters even less in Scotland, I don't have much, if any, sympathy for anyone shot by police for waving ANY sort of gun around in public, including replicas and toys.

I've been soaked by these in street in the past, by adolescents who think it's "funny".

I might keep this article, and return fire with a half-brick in future, and produce it as a defence article in court

This is, or rather was, a water gun, until it was modified into a super-soaker with a deadly squirt.

This sort of thing shows the media storm about 3D printing and guns was hyped up to create a storm in a teacup, and there's much more to worry about with real guns that can be fire more than once, rapidly, and are sure to fire the first, and each time thereafter, not jam on the first shot, take minutes to reload, and will fall apart after a few shots.

http://www.floridastatefop.org/pdf_files/OfficerSafety_SuperSoaker.pdf

Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 25 - 59
Admin
February 19, 2015, 1:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Grannies and pensioners go to jail if they have an old gun lying around the house, even if they don't know it's there.

But if a drunk 26-year old man waves a firearms around in Stoke - he gets a conditional discharge and charged £85 costs, not even a fine or the threat and suspension of the mandatory 5-year holiday given to little old ladies:

Polish man caught on the streets of Stoke with a gun avoids prison | Daily Mail Online

Good job he was lucky enough to have only been in the country for 6 months rather than 39 years or more, or he'd have been automatically locked up

Better carry a hip flask if taking the hardware out for an airing, in case seen.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 26 - 59
Admin
February 19, 2015, 11:03am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Didn't know this one was heading my way when I mentioned the Pole in Stoke.

He walks more or less free - drunk in possession of a firearm - while a Scottish lad (yes, behaving badly, no denying it) gets jailed for three years and told he could have been shot by police:

Shetland firearms teenager to appeal against three-year sentence

I remember 'The Good Old Days' only a few years ago, when the judge fined Poles £1,000 just for taking a picture in a public place (the street), which there is no law against, but the judge wanted to teach the man a lesson, and can abuse his position by imposing such a fine. Now even brandishing a gun in a pubic place doesn't merit an actual sentence or conviction.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 27 - 59
Admin
March 5, 2015, 3:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
Ummm...

NOT a soft target?
Quoted Text
Darren McInally, 28, pleaded guilty at the High Court in Glasgow to possessing the gun and ammunition.

He also admitted assaulting his partner Hazel King, 22, at her cottage in Uplawmoor, Renfrewshire, last November.

McInally faces a minimum of five years in jail when he is sentenced next month.

The court heard that McInally had turned up at Ms King's home and started yelling abuse at her as well as accusing her of being unfaithful.

Prosecutor Angela Gray told the court the accused had refused to leave Ms King's home. He grabbed her, threw her onto a sofa, brandished a bottle at her and left her fearing she was going to be hit.

Police were called and traced McInally to his father's home in Neilston, Renfrewshire, where they found a loaded Scorpion sub-machine gun in the boot of his Audi car.

McInally's DNA was later found on the weapon and the ammunition.

Darren McInally admits assault and possessing a machine gun - BBC News

Probably this:

Scorpion SA Vz 61 submachine gun (Czechoslovakia / Czech Republic) (there are other variations, and more modern versions).





Caliber: 7.65x17mm (.32ACP) in vz.61; also 9x18mm Makarov in vz.82 and 9x17mm (.380ACP) in vz.83
Weight: 1.28 kg without magazine
Length (stock closed/open): 270 / 517 mm
Barrel length: 115 mm
Rate of fire: ca. 850 rounds per minute
Magazine capacity: 10 or 20 rounds
Effective range: 25 meter

Interestingly, it has a 'rate-reducer' which cuts down the firing rate to a mere 850 rpm.
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 28 - 59
Admin
March 9, 2015, 11:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ctrl-Alt-Del-Aye-Right!
Secret
Posts: 13413
Location: Scotland-ish
At last, a non-gun-toting granny example!
Quoted Text
arents of a four-year-old girl were baffled when a police officer threatened to confiscate her bike because she was cycling on a pavement.

Sophie Lindley, who uses stabilisers, was cycling on Trent Road, Grantham with dad Dale, when they were stopped.

Police accepted while cycling on pavements was illegal, officers should use discretion with young children.

One cycling charity pointed out being under 10, Sophie is too young to be able to break the law.

Mr Lindley said they regularly let Sophie cycle to school.
'Safety is priority'

"We stopped to look at some ducks when the officer pulled over and said she had to get off," he said.

"He said 'The law is the law' and she was not allowed to ride on the path.

"He said 'If I catch you put her on her bike further up the road I will turn around and confiscate the bike'.

"I couldn't believe it. It's daft."

Sophie's mum Emma Stephenson said she understood it was illegal to ride on the pavement.

"But, it is ridiculous to think a four-year-old is not allowed," she said.

"The most unbelievable thing is they were going to confiscate the bike."

Lincolnshire Police apologised and said: "Safety is our priority and cycling on the pavement is illegal.

"However, common sense obviously prevails and in the case of young children officers should use their discretion and offer the most appropriate advice for the circumstances."

Grantham girl, 4, gets cycling-on-path police warning - BBC News

Be interesting to see if this flares up on the Interwebs
Logged Online
Site Site E-mail E-mail Reply: 29 - 59
2 Pages 1 2 » All Recommend Thread
Print Print Thread

SeSco    Secret Scotland    Around the country  ›  Soft targets and bias

Thread Rating
There is currently no rating for this thread