Driving through the Eastend of Glasgow a couple of weeks ago I couldn't believe how many of miles of grey fence there were surrounding the games sites. Only at one was there something visible above the fence.
I spotted this tenement, obviously now derelict and just outside of the fence. Is it going to be the next casualty?
It must have been an interesting building to live in as furniture is designed for square rooms.
Where is it, Dalmarnock? Can't quite place the view.
It should be remembered that many buildings like this have lain derelict for years, and the area has even seen high flats appear and disappear in the same time, as well as more modern building like small blocks of flats, as seen in the Dalmarnock building query thread.
Things are kicking into gear now, with more of the areas earmarked for this farce of a few days fun and earnings for an élite few, postured as some sort of benefit for the City of Glasgow and its residents in the east end.
I only hope the media does the usual accounting about five years after the dust has settles, and counts the cost of mounting this extravaganza against the promised income.
There's great promises of income and lasting benefits, but this remains to be proven, and justify how a few days of visitors being parachuted in is balanced by years of expenditure.
The real misery is having to wait until something close to 2020 before the accountants, councils, investors etc etc have their paperwork completed and audited, and the media tells the taxpayers where our money disappeared to.
Do I sound ticked off by this nonsense, rather than going out and dancing in the street because 'we' won the games?
A bit of a coincidence, but I was out on London Road this morning and noticed the following
Visible is half a sign advertising that the area obscured by the shuttering extends to some 16 acres, and is (or rather was) going to be a prestigious shopping development on a former brownfield site.
I thought I had a proper pic of the whole sign, but seem to have mislaid it, but the original was twice the width of the remains, with the usual glamorous, glassy, brightly lit shopping area shown (some can still be seen) - I didn't fancy it, and to be honest, when the sign appeared some years ago, nor did I expect the development to materialise. I didn't believe it, and suspected that it was fiddle of some sort - money being collected for surveys, reports etc etc, with no real intent to deliver anything one day. The surrounding area has a few industrial businesses, a lorry recovery business, scaffolding supplier, plumbing supplier, builders yard, and a large Wickes adjacent.
If they needed a space to throw up some stuff that pandered to the Commonwealth Games, there's 16 acres standing idles, cleared and ready to go, and with nothing needing to be demolished either. It even sits on the dual carriageway of London Road, giving direct access to places such as the proposed facilities and whatever else is going to be planted in the area of Tollcross and Parkhead.
Just a thought, remember some very pleasent times at the Glasgow Garden Festival, now that was an efficient vehicle for generating income all across the board. In addition was very well attended and the fact that the tramcars were again in evidence, enhanced the visit.
The Games income from a very short sojourn, probably a lot less than the Festival, and is offset by longer benifits of an infrastructure that will enhance the East end of Glasgow. However what was the net result of the last games held in Edinburgh?
Probably a net loss - I'm sure there is a report online somewhere, where the numbers were juggled
It may not even have been the Edinburgh event, but it was certainly something brought up to hit the folk that dangled the carrot of "offset by longer benefits of an infrastructure that will enhance the East end of Glasgow" - (not picking on your phrase W, just using it as handy text to save me thinking of a way to say much the same).
I would have to argue that there is simply no comparison with the Glasgow Garden Festival, which was actually a disaster in term of it legacy.
We knew it was a temporary event that would be razed and sold off where possible, once the event was over.
We were promised housing on the area - we got a few luxury flats built for the festival, and nothing else.
We were promised business and industry would follow and move onto the site and into the area - the opposite happened, and even the docks that lay next to the site were soon gone, as has most of the industry that was there.
There's defintely a report published online in the later years, reveiwing the costs and returns, but I think it was written by Glasgow Council for itself, so you can imagine what was in it, and how it concluded. I must have a dig around for it again.
Only in recent years have we seen the BBC etc move into the area, and for a festival that took place in 1988 their arrival (with some others) post-2000 can hardly be credited to the festival.
We have the farce of the Glasgow Tower - forever broken and under repair from the day it opened, embarrassing Glasgow, and definitely not Clydebuilt, despite almost being in the river.
The pointless science centre - which no-one learns the lesson that we can't make these fund themselves.
I presume the IMAX theatre is making money. I've only been once, but I never hear anyone complaining about it, so hope 'no news is good news'.
The place is still a wasteland in many areas, and the only high spot is the little bit of the original ground they left alone, put a wall around, and called Festival Park.
I thought that's what it was, but the angle of the pic threw me right off, as I usually see it from Springfield Road, and the lens distortion makes it look much narrower than it really is.
The high flats and school (we covered elsewhere) were in the midst of the currently grey and flat area just to the southeast.
The athletes' village will be just to the northeast, and you will have seen the recently restarted works there now.
If you weren't there last year, then the area now being built on there was deeply excavated - just our of view of the road - as massive pipeworks were installed together with huge manifolds the size of room were installed underground to cope with the new housing.
After this was completed, the works lay dead until a few weeks ago, when it all sprang back into life, and the area between Springfield Road and the Clyde and the Clyde Walkway is now busy building site.
The private development further to the northeast,on the former site of Belvedere Hospital ground to a halt last year, far from complete, and lies the same way today, with even the sales office boarded up and hidden behind wooden shuttering.
Presumably the developer planned to make a killing selling the place to games goers (at hugely inflated prices) but no-one is interested in flats and houses that are sold as 'Luxury accommodation in the east end of Glasgow, a stone's throw from Parkhead football ground, and the trouble and traffic snarl up that takes place there every time Celtic play.
The place turns into a massive, jammed, coach and car park, with the usual football fan accompaniment.
What is this obsession with so called Luxury flats, AKA Executive Eggboxes, what about for once building lower cost housing and more for the rental market rather than catering to a few spamheads. It puts me in mind of an old episode of Rab C Nesbitt where he's wandering down the quayside much to the distress of a 'flat' owner while he shouts that he'll move in with his tribe of weans.
There was a development years ago in Ayr where the thing was that badly planned that the lifts couldn't even fit in the shafts designed for them, and apparently the flats were pretty pokey.
However, in another part of the south side of the River Ayr harbourside, Ayrshire Housing association builts a cluster of well maintained, new and modern two level, two bedroom houses that are solely for rent. The condition of being with this association is that the houses can't be bought and remain forever in the rental market which is a good thing. The assocation apparently reinvests in new housing and has been one of the few rental agencies that seems to continually expand.
As a contrast, Bourtreehill, where I used to live was sold off, and even in some part, large swathes of houses were sold to landlords...
I lack the geographic wherewithal to comment on what is happening in Glasgow's East End as it starts the preparations for the Commonwealth Games in 2014, but I am in full agreement with all the disparaging comments regarding the Games, as for example, that expressed by Apollo in the following:
"... areas earmarked for this farce of a few days fun and earnings for an élite few,..."
It is my feeling that the reason for such 'sporting extravaganzas' is long past. There is little if any feeling of true sportsmanship in such events today. They no longer provide a means of furthering a general interest in a particular sport. Competitors today are bent on establishing a means of earning a living, or as in some case, acquiring a fortune. In many cases, as is the case in Canada, the financial cost of the time spent training for these events is underwritten by the taxpayers in the country. Oh yes, it may well bring a few 'attaboys' and some money into the city coffers or further the belief in some political organisation, but at what price overall!
I was involved in the sport of cycling for a large part of my life and while I enjoyed it, it was never anything other than sport. Now in Glasgow they are going to build a veledrome so that a handful of cyclists can perform. They intend to have hundreds of seats for spectators. Now where in the name of goodness are they going to find the people to fill the velodrome after the '14 Games are over and done with? I raced at track meetings in Glasgow and the only spectators were other cyclists or relatives of the cyclists competing. A velodrome in Glasgow is an utter waste of money...and if the Glasgow trackies complain too much, tell them there's one in Edinburgh!)
Hi all. it is indeed the corner of Sunnybank Street and Millerfield Road. The door on the corner was 'Wright's Dairy' - in the sixties and seventies, and the shutters to the right-hand side mark 'Mario's Fish & Chicken Bar'.
Following on from what Enigma has pointed out, there was a 'velodrome', of sorts, located in Westthorne Park, between London Road and the River Clyde. Not many people used it for cycling, and it lay disused from the seventies through to the late eighties. It is clearly marked on the OS pathfinder series of maps - now sadly, out of print. hope this helps.
Are you making an assumption about the track in Westhorne park, or does the Pathfinder map actually say velodrome, or cycle track?
This is an area I have looked at in the past, and apart from now being taken over by Celtic (football club), was previously only shown as a recreation park - with a large oval track not further identified in detail on any of the maps I've trawled up, including road maps from the 1970s, but I stress, not the Pathfinder map mentioned.
Prior to this, the area was occupied by reservoirs, and a pumping station, with even a landing stage leading out into the River Clyde.
A busy spot at one time, and still complete with its allotments!
Oddly, the area of the former track (and the former reservoirs) is unused and razed, with no evidence to be seen of the track or recreation area when I walk past, although the ground to the north and east has been converted to assorted flavours of football pitch, with the allotments along the southern edge.
A little while since I have walked down there - maybe they will add another couple of pitches there some time.
Your description reminds of Helenvale Park, a little to the north, which still survives, to some degree, but is abandoned and wrecked now.
Hi Apollo, thanks for that. It's an 'educated assumption' I guess, - based upon anecdotal evidence; - it was always referred to as 'the Cycle Track', and it was banked.
I am not referring to Helenvale Park, but to Westthorne Park. which lies between the Clyde and London Road. The 'Cycle Track' was immediately North-East of 'The Plots' (Allotments)
I was born in Belvedere Hospital in 1964, and lived at 40 Millerfield Road; from when the flats were built, until they were blown down.
I attended Springfield Primary and Riverside Secondary Schools. It is the area I know better than anywhere else )
BTW, Sunnybank Street, is; I believe, so named, because of the filtration ponds, which occupied the site of the tenement in the picture. In days gone by, -before the tenements cast their shadows, the street would have been quite open, running alongside the perimeter of Springfield House.
I've made no secret of my contempt for the so-called 'honour' or 'winning' by Glasgow of the competition to run the money-pit of the 2014 Commonwealth Games.
We are being gently brainwashed into believing this is a benefit for the city - while it is in reality nothing more than a feather in the cap of the council.
We are seeing old derelict areas of the city being razed, and sports facilities being parachuted onto the empty space, to create new derelict area of the city after the Games have gone.
If no-one wanted these facilities before, then they aren't going to magically flock to them after.
As witness to my prediction that two years after the Games have gone I will be able to use my now favourite phrase - 'I told you so' - I was both amazed and disappointed to see that Greece's Olympic stadia, no doubt created at huge cost to that country's taxpayers (we're told 'cost taxpayers $213 million, with the overall cost of the games estimated at $7.4 billion to $14 billion'), are lying abandoned. And the country has a huge national debt as well, but that doesn't mean the two are related, but $14 billion more, rather than $14 billion less, would no doubt be preferable.
And it would seem redundant to ask what benefit hosting the Olympic games was to Greece.
It would also seem redundant to observe that if Greece, the home of the Olympic games doesn't have a population that gives a damn, then what are the Scots going to do with a load of sports facilities the day after the Commonwealth Shames folk pack up and go home?
Here's a novel thought, and if I were you, I would sit down now, before I fell down, as this idea is so stunningly revolutionary, it will knock you off your feet...
Instead of the host nation paying a fortune to build stadiums and other facilities every few years to let a few privileged sporty types get rich (and let's not kid ourselves - this is their free advertising platform that will land the most successful of them multi-million sponsorships) at our expense - the games organisers and the athletes come up with the cash to build them.
I'm willing to bet that they would suddenly find that the existing facilities within the host nation were suitable, and that no 'new' expensive buildings or accommodation had to be built for every games, or that these 'games' suddenly lost all their supposed prestige, and they all melted away.
Most likely, Sky would come up with cash, and the thing would be plastered with ads and special subscriptions.
Oh...
With regard to the title of this thread (Games casualties)...
Did I mention that there are already special police and security operations being arranged in Glasgow to cater for the various international drug and prostitution rings, and con-artists that no-one mentions in public, but that follow these games around the world in vast numbers, eager to part the tourists, strangers, and vistors to the area from their money, and who make perfect fodder for them.
Apollo, I agree with every word in the above statements, they sell the concept on 'regeneration', Olympic Games in London, to bring life into a run down area.
Your last patagraph is spot on, large international gatherings bring every spiv out of the woodwork.
Before I started to read this thread I wasn't at all confused about where it was that I rode in a few bicycle races...I thought it was Westhorn; no,no, no, I thought it was Helenvale...ach now I have no idea where it was I raced!
I agree with all Apollo's comments about the value of the Commonwealth Games.
I wasn't able to divert as far down as the tenement that opened this thread, but when I passed the two building sites just to the north was a little surprised to see that there was little evidence of progress although work was in progress.
I suspect a combination of not being three metres tall (to be able to see over the screening around the sites) and protracted work on the foundations, combined to mask any signs of progress - I must have passed during a lull, as the only sound was of vehicles rumbling around, but about ten minutes later, I heard the sound of pile-drivers in action, so they're still preparing the ground.
I thought they were firing up the (private, not related to the official Games construction in any way) 'luxury' house build on the old Belvidere Hospital ground, as the gate in the fence around the remaining abandoned and derelict site was lying open, but it looks as if it was just the local neds' handiwork, as there was nothing there - apart from steadily increasing undergrowth now that the weather has improved.
Granted this item is related to the sites of former Olympic Games, but since this even larger disaster has fortunately been foisted on London in 2012, we can breath a sigh of relief in Glasgow, and rest reasonably secure in the knowledge that the egotists in Holyrood will never be able to afford to bid for this particular money pit...
Oh!!!
I just remembered, they built themselves a parliament building from various pieces of scrap thrown next to the Palace of Holyrood, and told us they were only going to spend £40 million on it, and it would be well worth it, and then spent £430 million on it instead, on the basis that "We've started, so we'll finish".
At least I'll be dead and gone when they do bid for the Olympics in Scotland, and Glasgow and Edinburgh will squander another small fortune just fighting for the right to bid, let alone host these 'games'.
Meantime, we can just watch money being poured by the million into a mere few days of Commonwealth Games, wait 10-15 years to see if any benefits ever followe, and in the meantime, take a look at what has happened to the much more significant Olympic Games' sites over more than a century - "Some are the products of politics and war rather than over-ambitious folly, but it seems that about half of the Olympic sites are gone or wrecked."
I passed that building today and it's still there. There was actually a young woman with a baby buggy going into it, and it made me wonder if that is the building in the news where they are trying to evict a woman. I decided to record the one next to it for posterity, it won't last long. These are fundamentally sound buildings which with a bit of renovation would outlast by a hundred years or more the jerry-built slums which will replace them.
Many of the flats in that building are occupied (at least down the street to the left of the pic), and not by poor people (in my opinion - I don't know any of them of course), but have often seen petrol guzzling 4x4s and business (traders) fans parked in the street.
That said, it's a few months since I was regularly passing there, so that situation may of course have changed by now.
Did you notice the modern block of flats visible just past this tenement building, which has been abandoned and lain unoccupied and boarded up for years, despite being 'new'?
Although shuttered, many of the shops on the ground floor are (or perhaps I should be careful and say were) still open, with customers plentiful from the houses across the road, and from those past the empty block of flats.
I'll have to make the effort to get down there, but so much has now been flattened on the road there, it never looks like an inviting walk
I suppose it's a bit of a cliché, but we shouldn't forget that one of the greatest casualties of the 2014 Commonwealth Games will be the truth.
In this case, it comes as little or no surprise to see that the numbers the organisers used to justify their project are flawed.
This is double-edges sword, and if it were not the case that I am such a cynic where this sort of nonsense is concerned, I would be saying that I found it hard to believe that such a fundamental aspect as taking proper account of inflation was not addressed satisfactorily. I would expect the organisers to take an unrealistically optimistic view of this factor, but I would also have expected those who the plans were submitted to to have returned them with a suggestion that something more realistic be presented.
Apparently not, and both should be brought to account, but as usual, I and the rest of the folk around the area will probably end up being accountable for any shortfall - games supporter or not.
Quoted Text
Glasgow Commonwealth Games ticket aim 'too ambitious'
Projected ticket sales for the Commonwealth Games in Glasgow could be too ambitious and may have to be revised downwards, MSPs have said.
In a report, Holyrood's Public Audit Committee also highlighted increases to the initial budget and issues around the way the budget has been managed.
The committee said organisers must monitor the situation to guarantee delivery on time and on budget.
Glasgow 2014 said it was confident that ticket sales would meet targets.
The concerns are outlined in the committee's report, Progress on Planning for the Delivery of the Commonwealth Games 2014.
The committee said that given the change in the economic situation since the Manchester Games in 2002, ticket sales projections for the Glasgow Games may be too ambitious and may need to be reviewed.
The committee recommends that, in view of budget increases to date, the organising Committee - Glasgow 2014 Ltd - should ensure "robust monitoring and risk management procedures are maintained to guarantee that the games are delivered on time and on budget".
The committee's report also highlights issues surrounding the way in which the budget has been managed to date and is concerned that potential inflationary increases had not been built into forecasts until May 2010.
Committee convener, Hugh Henry, said: "Given that the organising committee recognises that ticket sales may prove challenging for the Glasgow Games, early action should be taken to ensure maximum revenue is generated should sales figures indicate less than expected uptake.
"We are concerned that inflation had not been built into budget projections earlier and that the strategic partners continued to deal in 2007 prices.
That last line should be the signal for heads to start rolling...
The Scotsman's comments section is wonderful, as all the plonkers use the appearance of some common sense as an anti-BBC and anti-English opportunity to rant and rave.
Who knows, in four years, the the whole of the 2014 Commonwealth Games might be taking place on the sports grounds of Glasgow Green - and even then, there might not be many folk bothering to turn up and be bored out of their heads
Since WM had been kind enough not to point and laugh at my slightly out-of-date info about the shops etc above, I thought I should add some detail, just to prove I was not completely adrift
Starting from the usual viewpoint, this lot is clearly shut and gone for good, as confirmed by a nose around:
At least one of the empty shops has been raided, and the some of the stuff that used to be inside can be found outside, a little way away. And, there is an optimistic sign in the door, which there is little point in following the advice given:
This is a better view of the shop units seen in the distance. If my memory is right, then the last one of these to remain open up to the end was the lawyers - surprise:
Carry on around for more of the same, and another view of the more modern flats that I can confirm have been closed and sheeted over for years, long before this place was shut down to become a 'Games Casualty'
Just a few yards along the same street to the right was the factory of Thomas Stoddart, the well-known bed-makers. Only the derelict factory building remains there, abandoned some years ago.
Lastly, this building lies to the left of, and just across the road from the one shown in the opening shot - clearly abandoned and derelict?
No, it is actually still occupied, as I commented above (and thought I might now be wrong, but am not).
The 4x4 and vans are still there, and although I did not dare to go close enough to photograph the occupied flats in the tenement, I can assure they are still occupied down that side street. The may have nowhere else to live - or they may have some other reason for living there, either way, I didn't fancy being seen pointing a camera at their doors and window, within my rights to do so or not!
Couldn't do it from a distance either, as you will see, the streets are all blocked off, and the Games' contractors have shuttered the streets to close them off yet further, and restrict view of their site.
Interestingly, when I was there I noticed they were still flying barrage balloons over the area...
This part of the city is certainly going to be a very different place after the games and it will make traversing it more difficult for people like me. I tend to navigate from landmark to landmark especially when diversions are set up for some reason. I don't have, and will not have, satnav.
I've never had SatNav, but I can recommend welding yourself to a GPS unit if touring to strange places.
I've been welded to mine since 1997 - and used to travel to far and distant places of the land that needed maps and the sun (or a compass) to get back to a main road if exploring, and the amount of time it saved, and allowed me to visit places I would not have had time to see otherwise made paying the price for a good GPS in those days well worth the investment.
I've played with a few SatNav units in shops, and find they lack all the features that people with a brain can use in a GPS handheld.
That said, I have a small collection of top-end GPS units, and even they dumbed down significantly over the years, losing a number of 'advanced' technical features as they were 'improved'.
Bear in mind, I assume you are really traversing this area just to get through it, and will soon be able to avoid it altogether when the M74 link is completed.
The tragedy of all this is that televised sport does not encourage viewers to take part, but to lie on the couch with their crisps and lager, so far from encouraging a healthy lifestyle, it has the opposite effect. This is one of the reasons why I hate televised or commercialised sport and why I think brining these games to Glasgow will have a negative instead of a positive effect on the lifestyle and health of its citizens.
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